Jane Eyre Discussion #3

1/22/2013

Select one of the following prompts, and create a well-developed response. Be sure to use example from the text to support your arguments. When you have finished, reply to another student's response.

1. At many times in the novel, the weather adds significance to the events. What is the significance of the weather change in chapter 23?

2. After a long period with hardly any references to God, the final line of chapter 24 reveals: "I could not, in those days, see God for his creature: of whom I had made an idol" (307). What is the meaning of this statement?

3. In chapter 25, Jane inspects the wreck of the chestnut tree under which she and Rochester sat just before lightning hit the tree. The split trunk’s two halves lie apart, yet joined by roots and firm base. Given the significance of the natural world on Jane’s inner life, what might you infer about the wrecked chestnut tree?

33 Comments

Kelti Lorence

1/23/2013 08:09:30 am

#3. The fact that lightning just happened to split the very tree he proposed to Jane under is a very rare possibility in real life. This was probably added to bring a more supernatural happening to the story; a foreshadowing for the reader that something of high signifigance was about to occur. Because of the events the storm followed, I believe their marriage will either break apart quickly, or not happen at all due to unforseen events. However, Jane sees that the tree is still joined by the base, it's roots. It is possible that, though Jane and Mr. Rochester will probably be separated for a period of time, they will eventually be back together by an unexpected turn of events throughout the story.

Hannah Cox link

1/23/2013 09:36:16 am

It was a very good observation that the tree being struck adds a more supernatural occurance to the story and to Jane's relationship with Mr. Rochester. You are probably right in that the fact that the tree is still joined at the roots is significant. I think that it may also signify a deep connection between Jane and Mr. Rochester that is significant and strong enough to dictate some of what happens in Jane's future, whether or not she and Mr. Rochester come together after a time of separation.

Mackenzie

1/24/2013 04:44:08 am

I definitely agree that the split tree represents a "rare possibility in life". I also don't see Jane and Mr. Rochester's relationship will last very long.

Hannah Cox link

1/23/2013 09:28:49 am

2. The meaning of this statement can be found by looking at Jane's relationship with Mr. Rochester. Jane's words before the statement help clarify it: "Yet after all my task [to keep Mr. Rochester at a distance and thoroughly frustrate him by seeming cold and immovable] was not an easy one; often I would rather have pleased than teased him. My future husband was becoming to me my whole world; and more than the world: almost my hope of heaven. He stood between me and every thought of religion, as an eclipse intervenes between man and the broad sun." Jane, in other words, is completely obsessed with Mr. Rochester. So much so, in fact, that all other things, including religion and God, become lesser things in her mind. Mr. Rochester now represents the "hope of heaven" that she once let other things fill, such as freedom and control over her future. Jane is now viewing life through the filtered glass that she has let Mr. Rochester put over her eyes, and she now sees only him and her passion as a result of him. In this way, Jane truly seems to worship him, like an idol, and God (towards whom the reader still has difficulty understanding Jane's views) is eclipsed by "His creature." It is unclear at the time when this appears in the text what effect it will have on Jane's relationship with Mr. Rochester, but at the time it seems very likely that Jane will be mislead or come to expect something that does not exist.

Mary Sine

1/23/2013 01:20:00 pm

You make a good point about how Mr. Rochester seems to have become Jane's focus point in the world now. Your observation that Mr. Rochester now replaces the "hope of heaven" that used to be freedom and control over her own future for Jane, is a very good one. I agree that it is likely that Jane may be misled or come to expect something that does not exist because of this almost "hero-worship" of Mr. Rochester.

Mary Sine

1/23/2013 01:15:16 pm

1. The weather change in chapter 23 almost seems to be foreshadowing some sort of event in the future for Jane and Rochester. While they were talking and inevitably confessing their love to each other and agreeing to marry, the weather changed imperceptibly to them as they talked. And once they finish talking and Mr. Rochester says, "I know my Maker sanctions what I do. For the world's judgement--I wash my hands thereof. For man's opinion--I defy it." Then they notice that the weather has changed greatly, perhaps in response to their words. The sudden clouds that bring lightning (which splits the chestnut tree) and rain, are almost supernatural and very foreboding for the nature of Jane and Rochester's relationship. This weather change is part of the Gothic nature of the novel and seems to foreshadow that there is trouble and strife ahead for Jane and Rochester and their new relationship, perhaps with their future marriage. The weather change in chapter 23 is significant as a tool to foreshadow future events in the novel, especially events in Jane and Rochester's relationship.

Kendall

1/23/2013 01:59:38 pm

Marry i completely agree with you. I really like how you saw the change in weather as a way of kinda warning Jane and Mr. Rochester that there is trouble ahead and the world isn't going to be okay with their relationship.

Brady

1/23/2013 02:29:35 pm

I agree that this brings a certain level of mystery to the novel following the Gothic theme and just the type of weather with the rain and lightning, brings about a sense of chaos and uncertainty.

Kendall Maslen

1/23/2013 01:55:40 pm

#3 I think Bronte' puts the chestnut tree in the novel to symbolize Mr. Rochester and Jane's relationship. We can see the significance of the tree because that is where Mr. Rochester proposes to Jane, so therefore it kinda represents the start of their "actual" relationship and a new chapter in their lives. The fact that this exact tree was hit by lighting and split directly in half can be no coincidence. Bronte' put this connection between the natural world and Jane to be a symbolize Jane's new life with Mr. Rochester. I infer that the splitting of the tree will represent a separation between Jane and Mr. Rochester. I predict that because of their different social classes something will happen to separate them. I believe Mr. Rochester's history is going to catch up to him resulting in some sort of black mail and the separation between him and Jane. But although they will be split apart, they will find a way back to each other because their roots (history) and base (uncontrollable love for each other) are strong, just like the chestnut tree. "The split trunk’s two halves lie apart, yet joined by roots and firm base."

Carley

1/24/2013 02:56:25 am

Good inference about Jane and Rochester. I had the same thoughts about them coming back to each other too. (because of the strong base and roots)

Brady

1/23/2013 02:27:48 pm

1. The day starts off as the perfect day. She goes for a walk during the evening and is witnessing a glorious sunset. This entire setting makes everyone feel all fuzzy and warm inside. It makes you think that something good is going to happen because how could something possibly go wrong. Then, after her talk with Rochester, the weather changes. This is completely unexpected because you would think the day would keep on going all good because her dreams and passions were just fulfilled. This change in weather could signify that this wishes were not filled. Her feelings are actually that of false hope and accomplishment. This weather not only signifies that things were not really what they were. It signifies that they are horribly wrong and something terrible is going to happen because the weather didn't just change, it pretty much became a hurricane, so this happy life she believes she is about to turn upside down.

Trevor

1/23/2013 03:02:21 pm

Aww Brady felt all fuzzy and warm inside. Just kidding....

Anyways I like your idea of how the good weather represents falseness. It is like the calm before the storm.

Hannah H

1/24/2013 12:07:09 am

Very discriptive Brady. I enjoyed reading your interesting approach. Good ideas!

Trevor

1/23/2013 02:58:45 pm

3. The splitting of the chestnut tree in chapter 25 is clearly very strong foreshadowing. I think that it relates to the secrets of Mr. Rochester’s past. By asking Jane to marry him, he is breaking away from his past, but no matter what, a person is always attached to their past by their roots. Jane says that there must be a “little sense of life in you yet, rising out of that adhesion at the faithful, honest roots.” The roots of the tree represent Mr. Rochester’s early life, when he was still innocent, and there is still a small sense of life in them yet. I think Jane will hold on to Mr. Rochester’s minute innocence and remain faithful to him for the rest of her life.

Jacob Jones

1/23/2013 03:16:30 pm

I agree that Jane might remain faithful to Mr. Rochester, but I do not think that she will remain faithful enough to stay with or be married to Mr. Rochester.

Jacob Jones

1/23/2013 03:08:50 pm

3. I think that the wrecked chestnut tree is very significance to Jane’s inner life. The reason that the tree is significance is because Mr. Rochester proposed to Jane while they were under the chestnut tree. The next morning Jane finds out that the tree was struck by lighting and was split in two halves, but still joined by the roots. I think that means that Mr. Rochester and Jane’s marriage will not last and they will separate like the tree as it was struck by the lightning. However, I think that something will have to happen before they separate, because the tree did not separate for no reason. If Jane and Mr. Rochester do separate, I do not think that they will separate totally, I think that they will still be linked together by something. Since the tree did not separate entirely.

Megan W

1/23/2013 03:31:20 pm

I agree with your analysis. I feel like the link that they will still share will be not only their love for each other, but the willingness they have to push the social class boundaries and break themselves from what was socially accepted for the sake of their own freedom of love.

Megan Wall

1/23/2013 03:25:41 pm

2.The entire novel has been a religious roller coaster for Jane. At the beginning of the book she seems to not think too deeply about Christianity due to her cocoon of pain and neglect. However, when Mr. Brocklehurst comes ranting and raving about how she must pray and love the Psalms and not go to Hell, she is nearly forced to consider the religion presented. As her story proceeds at Lowood and she befriends Helen she sees a beautiful picture of love, forgiveness, kindness, and devout faith. Though, at first, she questions Helen's submissiveness and passive-aggressive nature in the name of faith, it seems when she returns to Gateshead and openly forgives Mrs. Reed that she has adopted Helen's ways. Though it would seem that Jane is doing well spiritually and has not changed much, she clearly depicts where her mind and heart are at spiritually; and it comes out that she is no longer mentally lingering on religious things, but earthly passions and feelings. She is not worshiping the Creator, but the creation. So, when she remarks that, "I could not, in those days, see God for his creature; of whom I had
made an idol" she means that instead of mulling over religion, she neglected it and was blind to God and religion by a man who, by thinking of him continually, she fabricated an idol that she doted on without end mentally. Most thoughts she shares in her spiritual-allusion drought are about Mr. Rochester, not God or the Bible.

Celeste Yahr

1/23/2013 04:31:02 pm

I really like your take on this Megan. I liked how you brought up her journey of religion and how she has changed. I agree with you!Good job!

Celeste Yahr

1/23/2013 04:26:23 pm

1. In chapter 23 Jane and Rochester finally talk to each other about their feelings for one another. At the beginning of the chapter Jane enjoys a nice walk in the sun light and it is just beautiful out. Towards the end of the chapter we have switch in the weather we see it on page 241 (in my book) right after Mr. Rochester says "Jane, be still a few moments: you are over- excited: I will be still too." the book then goes on to say "A waft of wind came sweeping down the laurel-walk, and trembled through the boughs of the chestnut: it wandered away--away--to an indefinite distance--it died." It also could be a warning to Jane because Rochester just told her to be still, but a wind came and moved everything around her saying don't stay still. Also the end of the quote says that the wind just died. I think that the wind could be foreshadowing the tree which symbolizes their relationship because we see later that the tree does indeed die and maybe its saying that their relationship will die too. The next weather change is right after Rochester says " For the world's judgment--I wash my hands thereof." (pg 243) It then begins to rain. Rain is a power force that can help grow plants or drown them. It can mean life or death, positive or negative. Most people associate rain with negative, but maybe here it symbolizes him washing his hands of the worlds view and something bad. The bad is the fact that with the rain came the lightning which killed the tree which symbolizes their relationship.

Ariana

1/24/2013 02:26:51 am

I liked your different prespective of the rain and it's meaning! Nice job!

Mika

1/24/2013 10:14:32 am

I like your thought on the wind's response to mr rochester; Inever though of that.

Hannah H

1/24/2013 12:04:44 am

.1. At many times in the novel, the weather adds significance to the events. What is the significance of the weather change in chapter 23?

The weather change in chapter 23 was significant because it foreshadowed upcoming events. "Skies pure...sun radiant...the trees were in their dark prime... contrasted well with the sunny hue." Pg. 290 (Chapter 23) after this introduction to the atmosphere of the day we discover that Jane and Mr. Rochester are getting married. The weather sets up for the perfect, ideal proposal. Later on in the chapter we see the weather change drastically. “Loud wind blew... thunder crashed...fierce and frequent as the lightning gleamed." Pg. 300(Chapter 23) These extreme weather changes add to the gothic nature of the book, and like I said before, act as a foreshadow of things to come; meaning that in the future what seems to be a bright sunny glorious day or even an event (marriage), may end in a hurricane. Nature in chapter 23, acts as if it knows the future.

Jonathon D.

1/24/2013 12:26:40 am

1. Well at first Jane describes the evening being a "splendid midsummer day" so this must mean that the weather was absolutely perfect. Jane described the day as, "skies so pure, suns so radiant as were then seen in long succession," This day could not have been a more perfect day for Jane being asked to marry Mr Rochester. The whole time during the proposal the weather stays just like this but right afterward the weather takes a drastic change. The clouds come in, there is lightning, wind and lots of rain. There could be a multiple of reasons why this happened right then and there. First of all it could be a sign that Jane saying yes was a horrible decsion and that there marriage was not going to work out or it could be just the opposite. It could be a sign that Jane and Mr. Rochester could make it through anything as long they were together.

Ariana

1/24/2013 02:24:33 am

1. At many times in the novel, the weather adds significance to the events. What is the significance of the weather change in chapter 23?

At the begining of chapter 23 the day is " a splendid Midsmmer" day; the "skies so pure" and the "suns so radiant". From the picture the we can conclude that the weather was warm and the sun was shineing intensely. A perfect summer's day. But as soon as Jane accepeted Mr. Rochester's request to marry him, the "wind roared in the laurel walk, and came sweeping over us", " the rain rushed down" and the chestnut tree " withed and groaned." A while later the chesnut tree, which he had proposed under, "had been struck by lightning in the night, and half of it split away". These elemetns of the weather add a gothic element to the book and foreshadow the events to come. The splitting of the tree could refer to Jane's and Mr. Rochester's relationship and how it might soon end or it could refer to how they want different things in life therfore making the goals in life seperate.

Carley

1/24/2013 02:54:40 am

Jane is explaining how she has made Mr. Rochester and their relationship the center of everything she did. She had no time to think of God or religion because “my future husband was becoming to me my whole world; and more than the world: almost my hope of heaven. He stood between me and every thought of religion, as an eclipse intervenes between man and the broad sun.” She was so infatuated with the thought of Rochester that he has become “my hope of heaven”, completely casting away the thought of God. Jane hasn’t had a completely steady rap sheet with her religion so when she began to fall in love with Mr. Rochester, it wasn’t hard for her to let go of her “every thought of religion” because he was more important to her.

Carley

1/24/2013 02:55:03 am

That's #2 btw.

Tristan Rude

1/24/2013 02:58:41 am

2) The line "I could not, in those days, see God for his creature: of whom I had made an idol" means that Jane thinks not of God or religion due to Mr. Rochester. They are engaged and she can think of nothing but her fiance. She says, "My future husband was becoming to me my whole world... he stood between me and every thought of religion." She has made Mr. Rochester an "idol" she says, she worships him by thinking of him and wanting him more than anything else. This is the meaning of this line and its significance is that Jane has made herself vulnerable should Mr. Rochester turn out to be less than expected.

Mackenzie

1/24/2013 04:40:26 am

The weather in chapter 23, I believe, represents some sort of foreshadowing.While they are talking and confessing their love for each other the weather is fine but once they are done the weather turns ugly and stormy. It represents that something bad is about to happen in their relationship. They don't even get to share a kiss after their confession of love.

Mika

1/24/2013 10:37:45 am

3. Nature often represent Jane's moods and deeper, subconsience thoughts that only her future self knows. chestnut trees are a symbol for love, and Jane was proposed to there, so I think that it may be foreshadowing their relationship. The splitting of the tree may mean a break in their relationship, but Jane's added detail about the base and roots tell that something will still hold them together- whether they want it or not. Specifically, I think that their marraige will be cancelled and Jane (Because i feel that Rochester will try to keep Jane) will be the one to keep it broken until it withers away completley. (because trees cannot be glued back together, eventually it will die)

Lacayah

1/24/2013 04:58:10 pm

3. Because the chesnut tree is where Jane and Rochester got engaged, it was a sort of symbol of their love. The fact that lightning had struck it in half was a bad omen, so to speak, for their relationship. It was signifying that something bad was going to happen that would tear the two of them apart. However, the tree wasn't split completely in half. "The firm base and strong roots kept [it] unsundered below. This shows that, even though something may come between them and tear them apart, they will always have an emotional conection that was built from basic characteristics, just as a tree is grown from basic elements. It is seen, in later chapters, that they are still attatched by their roots because roots are hidden from the world and can't be seen without digging a little deeper. So, when everyone tells her that she must leave Thornfield while she can, she is reluctant to because she still feels connected to Mr. Rochester. Until the tree is completely split, this will always be the case and they will always be connected. However, their love would not prosper again in this form for "the sap could flow no more: their great boughs on each side were dead." The "chesnut tree" for Jane Eyre and Mr. Rochester had undergone a traumatic experience that it would never bounce back from.

Emily

1/29/2013 01:20:58 pm

I liked your explanation of the roots.

Emily

1/29/2013 01:20:00 pm

1. At many times in the novel, the weather adds significance to the events. What is the significance of the weather change in chapter 23?

The first line says "A splendid Midsummer shone over England: skies so pure, suns so radiant as were then seen in long succession, seldom favour, even singly, our wave-girt land." In this chapter, Jane's perfect day happens. She gets everything she had wanted up to this point. At night, the moon is out and unclouded, which represents the truth coming out maybe. But, at the very end, it becomes windy and starts to rain, which fortells trouble ahead for Jane's happiness.

Jane Eyre Discussion #3

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